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Turns Out David Einhorn Did Have A Position In Herbalife

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David Einhorn

Ever since Bill Ackman announced that he was shorting multi-level marketing nutrition company Herbalife, the Street has wondered if his fellow activist investor, David Einhorn had taken a position as well.

Now, according to the WSJ, the word is out that he did have one in 2012, but closed out before the end of the year. He disclosed this information at an investor meeting at the Museum of Natural History yesterday.

Speculation that Einhorn had built a position in the stock didn't come from thin air. Back in May the activist investor jumped on an Herbalife conference call and asked three questions about the company's business model that sent the stock plummeting.  

Here are the questions Einhorn asked:

  • "First is, how much of the sales that you'd make in terms of final sales are sold outside the network and how much are consumed within the distributor base?"
  • "What is the incentive for supervisor to sign somebody up to become a distributor as opposed to - if they're just going to consume for themselves as opposed to just selling them the product for the markup. How does the distributor - how does the supervisor come out better?"
  • "When you had your previous 10-K, you disclosed three groups of distributors at the low-end. You called 29% self consumers, 57% small retailers, and 14% potential sales leaders and then that disclosure did not repeat in the subsequent 10-K. So, I got two questions, first of all how do you track that and how do you characterize and know which ones are which? And second, why did you stop disclosing that in the last 10-K? Is that something that you stopped tracking or just stopped disclosing?"

His questions amount to one simple point — whether or not Herbalife actually makes enough revenue outside its network of sellers to sustain the company. Bill Ackman asserts that it does not, and that the company is a pyramid scheme.

The WSJ says that Einhorn didn't get into much detail about his Herbalife short at his investor meeting (which was held at the Museum of Natural History). He said that he didn't want to "butt heads" with Ackman and hedge fund manager Dan Loeb, who has a long position in the stock.

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A Guy Took Out This Ad In The New York Times Telling Bill Ackman To 'Get A Life'

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A man from Cincinnati took out an ad in the New York Times telling hedge fund titan Bill Ackman to "get a life." 

Here's a copy that's being passed around on Twitter

Ackman, who runs $12 billion Pershing Square Capital Management, is shorting Herbalife, a multi-level marketing firm that sells nutrition products. He believes the company is a pyramid scheme and has a price target of zero.

The activist investor has pledged to donate 100% of his personal profits he makes from the short to charity. 

Herbalife's stock is currently above the pre-Ackman short level.

Since December 18, the trading session before Ackman confirmed his short, Herbalife's stock is up about 1.2%.  The stock touched a 52-week low of $24.24 on December 24th.  

SEE ALSO: Bill Ackman's Dizzying Takedown Of Herbalife >

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Carl Icahn Went On A Rampage Against Bill Ackman On TV

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carl icahn on the phone

At this point, the feud between Carl Icahn and Bill Ackman is legendary, but it's rare that either of the two parties actually talk about it.

Today, we got lucky.

Icahn was on Bloomberg TV with Trish Regan this afternoon, and he got super blunt about his dislike for Ackman.

Not that he really needs to — Icahn has taken the other side of Ackman's now famous Herbalife short. And in the past, the two have met in Court over a deal they did back in 2003 — Ackman won.

"Look, it's no secret to the world and to Wall Street - and most guys on Wall Street I sort of like and I get along with - and it's no secret I don't like Ackmanl," Icahn told Regan. "I have no respect for him and I don't like him and that's not a secret. But that doesn’t mean that I'm going to go in and buy stock in a company necessarily just to get him. Frankly, I don't like the way he did this anyway. If you're short, you go short and hey, if it goes down you make money. You don't go out and get a roomful of people to badmouth the company. If you want to be in that business, why don't you go out and join the SEC?"

Regarding Herbalife, he said that if Ackman had problems with the company's business model, he should not have a "holier than thou" attitude about the company and say "I'm doing this for the good of the world and I want to see sunshine on Herbalife," Icahn said.

"I mean, that's bull.... I just call it bull. I think it's completely disingenuous, but I think Bill Ackman is disingenuous," he added. "I'm not here to criticize Ackman necessarily but if you ask me about it, I'll tell you that's what I believe."

Regan correctly pointed out that Icahn is getting at the heart of a big philosophical question in today's world of public hedge fund battles. Sh asked Icahn if he thought short-selling and public positions were actually hurting the market, as some have argued.

Icahn agreed:

"You can't go out and say you're honestly good of humanity," he said. "You're doing it because you're selling something short and you want it to go down... If you listen to his (Ackman's) thing, I listened... you're just trying to scare a lot of people and I don't know how that helps the whole market and the whole sense of things... what you should be doing — if you're going to do that by the way and you believe you're doing the right thing — don't go out and short it first, go out and do it. I would say that's not the job of a guy who runs a hedge fund."

And that is why Ackman and Icahn can't even be in the same restaurant together.

Check out the full video below:

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BILL ACKMAN FIRES BACK AT CARL ICAHN: He's A Good Investor, But Does Not Keep His Word

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bill ackman

This keeps just getting so good.

Herbalife is turning into a Royal Rumble with all the big names all attacking each other.

Today Carl Icahn went on Bloomberg TV and slammed Bill Ackman for his "holier than thou" short of Herbalife, while reiterating that he didn't respect Ackman.

Now Ackman is out with a press release slamming Carl Icahn.

The gist: After a lengthy court battle, in which Icahn was forced to make a payout to Ackman's investors, Icahn called Ackman and said he wanted to be friends.

Ackman declined the friendship offers.

He then says Icahn is dishonest!

Great stuff, read:

-----------------------------------

NEW YORK,  Jan. 24, 2013  /PRNewswire/ -- In response to comments made today by  Carl Icahn  on Bloomberg Television,  William A. Ackman, CEO of Pershing Square Capital Management, L.P. ("Pershing Square") today issued the following statement.  

"On  March 1, 2003, on behalf of my former fund, Gotham Partners, I entered into a contract with  Carl Icahn, signed by him, to sell him a 15% stake in Hallwood Realty Partners.  He paid my investors  $80  per share and agreed to what he called "schmuck insurance."   The agreement provided that he would pay my investors an earnout equal to 50% of his profit on Hallwood after he received a 10% annual return if he "sold or otherwise transferred" his shares for value within three years.  Fewer than 13 months later on   April 14, 2004, HRPT Property Trust acquired Hallwood.  As a result, Carl and the other Hallwood shareholders received  $136.16  per share in cash for their shares.   

Under the terms of our agreement, Carl owed my investors about  $4.5 million. He refused to pay.  I was forced to sue him on behalf of my investors.  On September 6, 2005, the court awarded us summary judgment and found the agreement to be "clear and unambiguous."  He again refused to pay and appealed.  We won onappeal and Carl was forced to post a bond for what he owed us and appealedagain.   In general, Carl waited to the last few days to appeal in order todelay the inevitable.  After eight years and Carl's appeals of the judgment were denied, in 2011 the Court forced Carl to pay my investors the  $4.5 million
they were owed plus 9% interest per year from the date of the sale.

After Carl paid my investors, he called me up, congratulated me on winning, and said that he wanted to be my friend.  I told him that I had no interest in beinghis friend.   

Carl Icahn  is a great investor, but, in my experience, he does not keep his word."

For a copy of the contract agreement between Gotham Partners and Mr. Icahn, please visit:  http://goo.gl/BzUa9.  

About Pershing Square Capital Management, L.P.

Pershing Square Capital Management, L.P. ("Pershing Square"), based in  New York
City, is a SEC-registered investment advisor to private investment funds.
Pershing Square manages funds that are in the business of trading - buying and
selling - securities and other financial instruments.  Funds managed by Pershing
Square are short the stock of Herbalife Ltd.  Pershing Square may increase,
decrease, dispose of, or change the form of its investment in Herbalife for any
or no reason, at any time.  Pershing Square may change its views about or its
investment positions in Herbalife at any time, for any reason or no reason.
Pershing Square may buy, sell, cover or otherwise change the form or substance
of its Herbalife investment.  Pershing Square disclaims any obligation to notify
the market of any such changes.  Please see the full Disclaimer appearing on
website  www.factsaboutherbalife.com. 

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Roller Derby Girl Says She's Going To Knock Ackman Down If Herbalife Goes Under

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roller derby girls

A roller derby girl named Jillian Bellovary (a.k.a. "Big Banger"), who is a regular user of Herbalife, has some harsh words for hedge fund manager Bill Ackman if the company goes under.

She wrote the following to NPR's Planet Money: (emphasis ours) 

....Herbalife is pretty big in the roller derby community because they help sponsor a fitness/nutrition challenge (called Derbalife). The Herbalife products are not at all required for the challenge, but of course they are glad to educate us about them if we want to try them out.

So, if you are wondering who the Herbalife customers are — a bunch of them are rollergirls. The shakes are great and if the company goes under because of this short-selling nonsense then I am totally going to go knock that guy down.

Yipes! 

Ackman, who runs $12 billion Pershing Square Capital Management, is shorting more than 20 million shares of Herbalife.  He believes the multi-level marketing company that sells nutrition products is a "pyramid scheme." 

Ackman has also pledged to donate 100% of personal profits he makes from the short to charity. 

Since December 18, the trading session before Ackman confirmed his short, shares of Herbalife are up more than 1.7%.  The stock touched a 52-week low of $24.24 a share on December 24 and have moved back above the pre-Ackman short level since then. 

SEE ALSO: SALESMAN: Here's How Herbalife Got Me A $30 Million Mansion, A Fleet Of Fancy Cars And A Better Body >

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The Greatest Hedge Fund Brawl In Ages Is Happening Right Now — Here's What You Need To Know (HLF)

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Pulp Fiction McGuffin

Everyone has been talking about the hedge fund war over Herbalife — a multi-level marketing firm that sells weight loss and nutrition products.

One one side we have hedge fund titan Bill Ackman, the founder of Pershing Square Capital Management, who is shorting the stock.

After Ackman publicly declared his short, hedge fund heavyweight Daniel Loeb, the founder of Third Point LLC, took out a 8.24% stake in the company on the long side.  Some other fund managers have also gone long Herbalife after disagreeing with Ackman's short case.

Ackman's rival Carl Icahn hasn't publicly said if he's long Herbalife or not, but he slammed him on Bloomberg TV for his "holier than thou" short calling him "disingenuous."

It's definitely been a real-life clash of the titans.

The most important thing you have to realize is that Herbalife itself is just the "McGuffin" in this story. It's a plot device that moves the story along, but in itself means very little. A classic McGuffin was the unidentified glowing item in the briefcase in Pulp Fiction, which Marcellus Wallace was so eager to have returned to him. What was it? Nobody knew or cared. But a fabulous story hinged on it.

So, if you're just coming into this story, we've put together a comprehensive guide of everything you need to know about the Herbalife hedge fund war: 

  • On December 19, 2012, CNBC's Kate Kelly first reported that hedge fund titan Bill Ackman, who runs Pershing Square Capital Management, has been shorting Herbalife because he considers the company to be pyramid scheme. 
  • People knew for sometime that Ackman was short a company, but it wasn't clear which one. Ackman, who is known for being a long-only investor, had told investors in Pershing's Q1 letter in June that he had new short position.  Then, in October, during a CNBC appearance on "Squawk Box" he wouldn't reveal his short, but said the country would be better off when it goes out of business.
  • After CNBC reported Ackman's short, the stock began to tank.  That day, shares of Herbalife fell $5.16 yesterday, or 12.14%, to close at $37.34 a share. 
  • Herbalife's CEO Michael Johnson told CNBC in a telephone interview that Ackman's "pyramid scheme" claim is a "bogus accusation" and that it's "blatant market manipulation." 
  • The next day on December 20, 2012, Pershing Square gave an extremely in-depth three-hour long, 342-slide presentation at a special Sohn Conference event in Midtown Manhattan.  Ackman explained that he thinks Herbalife is a pyramid scheme.  He has a price target of zero and has pledged to donate any personal profits to charity.  He also refuted Herbalife's claim of market manipulation saying they didn't own options. 
  • Herbalife responded to Ackman's presentation later that day calling it a "malicious attack" and accused him of using "outdated" and "inaccurate information." The company also stated in a release that it is "not an illegal pyramid scheme." The company said that it would hold an analyst/investor day to rebut Ackman's claims. 
  • Ackman's attack on Herbalife didn't stop with his presentation.  He unveiled FactsAboutHerbalife.com.  The website features documents, promotional material from the company, videos and depositions.  He also took out some Google Ads when people search terms related to "Herbalife." 
  • On January 9, Daniel Loeb, the founder of Third Point LLC, filed a 13D with the Securities and Exchange Commission that his hedge fund had taken a 8.24% stake (8.9 million shares) in Herbalife.  In a letter to investors, Loeb said Ackman's pyramid scheme claim had "no merit" and called his short "preposterous." The New York Post later estimated that Loeb bought Herbalife at $32 a share
  • Other fund managers such as Robert Chapman of Chapman Capital and John Hempton of Bronte Capital disagree with Ackman's short case, too.  Hempton even published a blog post lambasting Ackman saying that he screwed up his short because he has a "misplaced silver spoon" and can't talk to poor people.
  • There was also speculation that David Einhorn of Greenlight Capital might be short.  Back in May, Einhorn raised some questions during an HLF conference call and the stock dived. The Wall Street Journal's Juliet Chung reported that Einhorn shorted Herbalife last year and it was  profitable for Greenlight.  Einhorn does not currently have a bet on the multi-level marketing firm that sells nutrition products.  It's also unclear how big his short was and what the profits were, the report said. 
  • The world's greatest short seller Jim Chanos weighed in on the hedge fund war between Ackman and Loeb in a Reuters TV interview.  He said he thinks it will come down to who can prove it's a good business proposition or not.  Chanos, who said he's looked at the MLM industry, wouldn't say if he's short Herbalife. 
  • On January 10, Herbalife hosted its analyst/investor day in Midtown Manhattan. The company gave a 102-slide presentation that aimed to debunk the points that Ackman made about their distribution, retail sales and accounting methods, among other things.  Herbalife also claimed that Ackman was "misleading" and used "misinformation."
  • Then, Ackman fought back.  He said "the company distorted, mischaracterized, and outright ignored large portions" of Pershing Square's mammoth presentation. He said Pershing Square would publicly release a series of questions and have another presentation. 
  • On January 14, shares of Herbalife rallied back above the pre-Ackman short levels.  They're currently up about 1.7% since December 18, the trading session before Ackman confirmed his short.  On December 24, the stock hit a 52-week low of $24.24 a share. 
  • The most recent news is that Ackman's rival Carl Icahn, who hasn't publicly said if he's long Herbalife or not, slammed him on Bloomberg TV for his "holier than thou" short calling him "disingenuous."  Ackman fired back in a press release saying Icahn is a good investor, but doesn't keep his word.

We'll keep following this story as it develops. 

SEE ALSO: The contract that started a huge feud between Bill Ackman and Carl Icahn >

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Here's The 'Schmuck Insurance' Contract That Carl Icahn Just Mentioned On CNBC...

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bill ackman

It's all out being put out there now.

The feud between hedge fund managers Bill Ackman and Carl Icahn reached a fevered pitch  yesterday, when Carl Icahn told Bloomberg TV's Trish Regan that Ackman was "disingenuous" in his short against multi-level marketing firm, Herbalife.

Last night, Ackman responded simply by detailing the root of he and Icahn's animosity, a 2003 deal over Hallwood Realty.

At the time, Ackman's hedge fund, Gotham Partners, was going bust. He needed to do a deal so he called up Carl Icahn and offered to sell him shares of Hallwood for $80 a share. It was trading at $60, but Ackman thought it was worth $140.

The deal was, if Icahn sold the shares within 3 years and made a profit of 10% or more, he and Ackman would split the proceeds. To ensure that the deal went off without a hitch, Ackman and Icahn signed a 10 page agreement they called "schmuck insurance."(Read it here)

From the contract:

“COVERED PROFITS” means 50% of the net amount (after reasonable commissions, legal expenses and regulatory filing fees and expenses) derived by Purchaser and its Affiliates on the sale or other transfer of a Covered Unit in excess of the sum of: (i) $80.00 plus (ii) interest thereon accruing on a daily basis at a rate of 10% per annum (equitably adjusted for splits, stock dividends and similar events). For example: if Purchaser derives net proceeds of $100 on the sale of one Covered Unit that it has held for 18 months, then the “Covered Profit” on that Covered Unit would be $4.00 computed as follows:

$80.00 + $12.00 (accrued interest) = $92.00
$100.00 - $92.00 = $8.00
$8.00 x 50% = $4.00

Ultimately, the two didn't argue about the math. They argued about the meaning of the world "sale." A year after Icahn and Ackman sealed this deal, another company bought Hallwood for $137 a share. Ackman called Icahn for Gotham's money, and Icahn said no arguing that he never sold the shares.

Ackman countered that Icahn didn't have the shares anymore and had made money so....It was time to go to Court.

In 2011, Icahn lost and had to pay Gotham $9 million plus legal fees:

In the event that any Seller Indemnified Person brings a legal action against Purchaser in order to enforce its right to such indemnification, if it is ultimately determined by a final non-appealable order of a court of competent jurisdiction that: (i) such Seller Indemnified Person is so entitled to indemnification, then such Seller Indemnified Person asserting such claim shall also be entitled to recover the reasonable cost and expense of counsel incurred in asserting such claim and bringing such action against Purchaser; or (ii) such Seller Indemnified Person has not prevailed in any such action, then such Seller Indemnified Person shall pay to Purchaser the reasonable cost and expense of counsel incurred by Purchaser and its Affiliates in defending such claim.

Ackman admits that after the whole battle was through, Icahn called him to shake hands and be friends.

That obviously did not happen.

Here's the full contract.

Icahn/Ackman agreement by

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Shares Of Herbalife Soaring While Bill Ackman Brawls On CNBC


Bill Ackman And Carl Icahn Just Brawled On CNBC In The Greatest Moment In Financial TV History

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ackman ichan

Activist investor Bill Ackman, the founder of $12 billion Pershing Square Capital Management, and billionaire investor Carl Icahn brawled moments ago on CNBC's "Halftime Report" hosted by Scott Wapner.

It was one of the greatest moments in financial television with two hedge fund titans, who have been feuding for a decade, going head-to-head. Watch the full video here >

The segment was originally set up for Ackman respond after Icahn blasted him yesterday on Bloomberg TV

Yesterday, Icahn, who has publicly said before that he doesn't like Ackman and has "no respect" for him, ripped into his "holier than thou" short on Herbalife in an interview with Trish Regan. Icahn also called Ackman "disingenuous" and said he's not shorting Herbalife "for the good of humanity." 

Ackman then fired back yesterday evening in a press release saying Icahn is a good investor, but he doesn't keep his word.  

He joined CNBC today to respond to his long time rival.

Earlier in the CNBC segment, Ackman told Wapner that he finds it interesting that Icahn thinks it's a bad thing that he gave a short at a Ira Sohn event when Icahn also gave a short thesis in 2002 and 2003 at a Sohn Conference. 

Ackman's Pershing Square is shorting more than 20 million shares of Herbalife — a multi-level marketing firm that sells nutrition products.  Ackman said at a Sohn Conference event last month that he thinks the company is a pyramid scheme and has a price target of zero. 

Minutes into the segment, Icahn called in after the first commercial break to respond to Ackman on live TV.  It couldn't get any better!

He responded after Ackman basically called him a hypocrite.

"Listen.  You know, I've really sort of had it with this guy Ackman, you know," Icahn told CNBC.

Icahn then started going over some history of a deal from back in 2003 over Hallwood Realty when Ackman ran Gotham Partners, which was being hit with redemptions and investigated by the SEC at the time over MBIA. (Ackman was never charged with any wrongdoing.)

If you're not familiar with the story, Ackman called Icahn and asked him to buy shares of Hallwood Realty, a real estate company trading for about $60, but Ackman said was worth $140. Hallwood merged with another company for $137 a share, Icahn wouldn't give Ackman a cut.

A lawsuit followed and Ackman won and Icahn paid him $9 million Ackman's investors were owed. 

"I'm telling you he's like a crybaby in the schoolyard.  I went to a tough school in Queens you know and they used to beat up the little Jewish boys.  He was like one of the little Jewish boys crying that the world is taking advantage of him..." Icahn said when Ackman called him up in 2003, adding "You rue the day I ever met the guy."

He then started going over how Ackman's old firm Gotham Partners was being investigated by Eliot Spitzer and the SEC at the time and how he didn't realize that.

Icahn said this deal they did "cost him money." Ackman ultimately won in court.  What's more is Ackman was never charged with any wrong doing on that SEC investigation over MBIA.

"He's the quintessential example of if you want a friend on Wall Street, get a dog," Icahn later said.

Wapner then let Ackman come into the conversation talking about his MBIA short.  MBIA alleged there was a "conspiracy to drive down its stock price." Ackman, who said MBIA didn't deserve a triple-A rating, ended up being right when the credit crisis hit.

There were a lot of insults flying during the segment.  Ackman said that he wanted to defend his reputation.  He also said it's not a "great use of CNBC air time." 

Then, it went back to Icahn and Wapner asked if he's long or not.

Icahn said he didn't come onto CNBC to be "bullied" after asked him that.

"No one's bullying you, Carl," Wapner responded.

"Listen to me... I want to say what I want to say and I'm not going to talk about my Herbalife position because you want to bully me...I don't give a damn about what you want to know. I want to talk about what I want to talk about...You can say what the hell you want.  I'm going to talk about what Ackman just said about me, not about Herbalife... I'll talk about Herbalife when I goddamn want to...I'm never going on a show with you again, that's for damn sure, OK." Icahn shot back.

Throughout the segment, Icahn dropped some g-d bombs and "bullshit" and you could hear the floor traders at the NYSE reacting saying "Ooohhh!" 

He then proceeded to slam Ackman.  "As far as I'm concerned, he wanted to have dinner with me.  I couldn't figure out if he was the most sanctimonious guy I met in my life or just arrogant and that's Ackman," Icahn said.  

Wapner, who was basically a referee, tried to ask Icahn if he was long Herbalife.

"Let me finish what the hell I want to say," Icahn snapped at Wapner. "You let Ackman talk." 

"I will tell you one day I think HLF will be the mother of all short squeezes," Icahn said claiming Ackman used the short to boost his return. 

"He talks about charity.  That's complete bullshit!" Icahn said. 

Wapner gently reminded him that we're on live television.  "That was an interesting choice of words," Wapner said. Again, you could hear NYSE floor traders say "Ohhhh!."

Ackman then jumped in.

"The big issue about Carl Icahn, is he's not used to someone stepping up to him," Ackman said, "Especially like me in 2003." 

Wapner asked Icahn again if he's long Herbalife and what the motives are behind it.

Icahn said "bullshit" again and accused Wapner of "bullying" him.  Again, the NYSE traders reacted screaming "Ohhh!" 

The conversation turned back to the Herbalife short.

"If there's ever a short squeeze, what the hell does he do?" Icahn asks.  "Ask him!"

Ackman said, "Carl is free to make a tender offer for the company."

"Hey, hey you don't have to tell me what I'm free today," Icahn shot back.

"What I thank Carl for is he helped highlight issues with Herbalife," Ackman said accusing him of buying the stock and selling it.

The attacks continued, though.

"I appreciate you calling me a great investor, but unfortunately I cannot say the same," Icahn said. 

"Bill, I appreciate you coming on. Carl, I hope you will come back," Wapner said.

Before Icahn called in...

Ackman says that Herbalife has done harm to millions of people and it deserves scrutiny.  

He says the press wrote some "fun pieces" on Bill Ackman v. Dan Loeb or Bill Ackman v. Carl Icahn.  He says the goal is to shed the truth about the company and get the press dig into it. 

He's talking about short selling in the market.  He notes that it's unfortunate that they've lost some money so far. 

He says shorts play an important role in the market.  

CNBC's Scott Wapner asked if Ackman is friends with Daniel Loeb of Third Point.  

Loeb took an 8.24% stake (8.9 million shares) on the long side after Ackman's short calling Ackman's accusations "preposterous." 

Ackman said they've both been in the business a long time. 

"If he [Dan Loeb] stays long Herbalife, he will lose his entire investment," he said later in the interview.

Loeb is also reportedly short Nu Skin.  Ackman says he doesn't understand why he would be short Nu Skin when he's long Herbalife.   

Ackman says that he doesn't need to be "loved by everyone." 

He's also calling about Bob Chapman of Chapman Capital who he said came out and said he had a large position.  Ackman says that Chapman Capital has less than a $100 million AUM.

On His JCPenney Stake... 

Ackman, who is the largest shareholder of JCPenney, is talking about that investment.  He has taken a bath on the stock so far.

He's says CEO Ron Johnson has done some "incredible things," though. 

He said if Johnson can't turn it around in three years, then he's not the right guy. 

He does, however, expect the retailer to make progress. 

"Ron is going to work to solve the problems," he said. "I have enormous confidence in him...He's brilliant." 

SEE ALSO: The Greatest Hedge Fund Brawl In Ages Is Happening Right Now — Here's What You Need To Know >

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POLL: Who Won The Brawl Between Carl Icahn And Bill Ackman?

FULL VIDEO: The Carl Icahn Vs. Bill Ackman Rumble That Everyone Is Talking About

The 5 Most Brutal Zingers That Carl Icahn Said To Bill Ackman On CNBC

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carl icahn

Activist investor Bill Ackman and billionaire investor Carl Icahn just squared off in the best moment in financial television on CNBC's "Half Time Report".

The epic feud between these two titans goes back a decade when Ackman was running his former hedge fund Gotham Partners.  In short, they did a deal together and it ended up going to court with Ackman winning.

Today, Icahn, who was dropping curse words left and right on live TV, was full of insults for Ackman.  He even had a few for host Scott Wapner, who was basically a referee today. 

We noticed that Ackman held his composure during the segment.  He didn't throw around curse words or mean insults.  He mostly just called Icahn dishonest.

Anyway, here's a round up of some of the little gems that came from Icahn's mouth today.

ON WHEN ACKMAN CALLED HIM IN 2003:

"I'm telling you he's like a crybaby in the schoolyard.  I went to a tough school in Queens, you know, and they used to beat up the little Jewish boys.  He was like one of the little Jewish boys crying..." 

ON ACKMAN AS A FRIEND:  

"He's the quintessential example of 'if you want a friend on Wall Street, get a dog'."

ON HAVING DINNER WITH ACKMAN:  

"As far as I'm concerned, he wanted to have dinner with me. I couldn't figure out if he was the most sanctimonious guy I met in my life or just arrogant and that's Ackman."

ON ACKMAN DONATING ANY HLF PROFITS TO CHARITY: 

"He talks about charity.  That's complete bullshit!"

ON ACKMAN SAYING ICAHN IS A GOOD INVESTOR: 

"I appreciate you calling me a 'great investor', but unfortunately I cannot say the same.'

**BONUS: ON WHEN SCOTT WAPNER ASKED HIM IF HE'S LONG HLF: 

"I want to say what I want to say and I'm not going to talk about my Herbalife position because you want to bully me...I don't give a damn about what you want to know. I want to talk about what I want to talk about...You can say what the hell you want.  I'm going to talk about what Ackman just said about me, not about Herbalife... I'll talk about Herbalife when I goddamn want to...I'm never going on a show with you again, that's for damn sure, OK." 

 It was entertaining to say the least. 

For the full roundup, see here >

SEE: The 16 Nastiest Financial Feuds >

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ACKMAN: Here's The Problem With Ron Johnson's Vision For JCPenney Right Now (JCP)

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bill ackman

Activist investor Bill Ackman went on CNBC's "Half Time" today and before his monumental confrontation with billionaire investor Carl Icahn, he provided some insights about what's going on at the struggling retailer.

He's the largest investor in JCPenney and he has fully supported CEO Ron Johnson throughout an extremely turbulent year.

Ackman noted that Johnson has done some "incredible things" so far at JCPenney. The vision he came up with is a big one and it appears to be working thus far.

"What Ron is doing here is something that is almost never been done before, certainly in the context of a public company," said Ackman.

But there's one big problem with it right now.

"The problem with the vision is it's a small percentage of the store, which is the so-called 'shop' strategy," said Ackman. "It's 10-11 percent of the square footage."

Sales in the shops have been strong thus far. IZOD, for instance, recently said that its new shops in JCPenney stores are a "home run."

That other giant chunk of the store, though, is killing JCPenney.

"The negative is 90 percent of the store," said Ackman. "Very very difficult year. Sales results reported so far — mid 20s down comps. Those are numbers that no retailer likes to see."

So, what would it take for Ackman to determine that Johnson actually wasn't the right person for the job?

"If three years from now, Ron Johnson is still struggling to turn around JCPenney, then he's probably the wrong guy," said Ackman.

He elaborated when pressed by CNBC host Scott Wapner. Will an activist investor like Ackman actually wait three full years to see of Johnson's ideas will work?

"The answer here is: JCPenney's going to make progress," said Ackman. "I expect it will and Ron expects it will as well. Again, no company survives down 25 percent comps over 3 years that's not happening. Ron is going to work to solve the problem."

"And I wouldn't project the future based on the last 12 months. That would be the advice I would give."

Here's the video — from CNBC:

SEE ALSO: See What JCPenney's New Shops Look Like [PHOTOS] >

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The 17 Nastiest Feuds In Wall Street History

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Jay Ghould and Cornelius Vanderbilt

On Friday, everyone across Wall Street was absolutely transfixed when hedge fund titans Bill Ackman and Carl Icahn, who have been notoriously feuding for a decade now, went head-to-head on CNBC's "Halftime Report."

The insults were flying with Icahn calling Ackman a "crybaby in the schoolyard" and dropping curse words left and right.  Ackman, who refrained from using profanity, mostly called Icahn dishonest and not a nice person.

The best part, though, was that you could hear the floor brokers and market-makers at the New York Stock Exchange oohing in the background as the epic battle of the billionaires played out.  

Of course, Icahn and Ackman aren't the first to fight on Wall Street.

With big money and reputations at stake, it's no surprise that disagreements and quarrels have broken out in the world of high finance.

Sometimes the fights are between bank execs and fund managers and other times the financial media and politicians get pulled into it, too. 

What's more is the fights between high-powered individuals tend to get thrown into the public spotlight.

We've rounded up some of the best feuds in financial industry. Who doesn't like a good knock-down, drag out?

Dan Loeb vs. Ken Griffin

In 2005, Citadel founder Griffin's poaching of New York hedge fund employees caught the eye of Third Point's Dan Loeb. Griffin, who charges a higher management fee than traditional hedge funders, was allegedly luring the employees away with offers of higher salaries.

Loeb, who is known for his scathing letters to CEOs when he feels that companies he has invested in are not doing well, took up his poison pen and wrote Griffin a scathing letter. In it, he called Citadel a "gulag" and forbade him from approaching any Third Point employees under any circumstances. He also told Griffin matter of factly that Citadel was "over-rated" and that Griffin does not know how to manage people.

Here's our favorite bit from the letter:

I understand your need to hire employees from other firms, something that Third Point has not had to do based on the fact that, unlike yourself, I actually enjoy and have talent in investing and am able to nurture others within my organization whom I hire from wide ranging disciplines such as graduate schools, private equity firms and medicine.

Source: Insider Monkey



Cornelius Vanderbilt vs. Jay Gould

Financiers Jay Gould and Cornelius Vanderbilt engaged in one of the most epic feuds dubbed the "Erie war" in an effort to control Erie Railroad.

In 1868, Gould, a railroad developer who was a member of the board of directors for the company, teamed up with his co-conspirators James Frisk and Daniel Drew to issue a bunch of fraudulent shares of the Erie Railroad's stock.

He was able to legalize his actions by bribing legislators in Albany. 

This ended up watering down the stock price causing Vanderbilt to lose about $7 million.  

Gould later returned most of that money back, but Vanderbilt lost his attempt to control the company.

Source: Commodore: The Life of Cornelius Vanderbilt

Source: notablebiographies.com



Bill Gross vs. Jeremy Stiegel

In August 2012, bond king Bill Gross took a few shots at Wharton finance professor Jeremy Siegel in an investment letter explaining why stocks are going to be horrible investments.  

Siegel later appeared on CNBC and explained how Gross's analysis was wrong

He also appeared on Bloomberg TV and pointed out that Gross had called for the DOW to fall to 5,000 back in 2002 over the next 10 years but that it was at about 13,000. 

Gross appeared on Bloomberg TV shortly after that and fired back with, "Well Professor Siegel is getting a little nasty here but it seems like the gloves are off." 

What's more is in response to Siegel pointing out that Gross's analysis was off when he looked at the hundred year time frame for the 6.6% return, Gross responded with, "Well Professor Siegel's Ivory Tower again lacks common sense. If wealth is created at 3 percent a year in terms of GDP and that wealth is divided as it always is by government, by labor, and by business in the form of corporate profits, then its hard to see how one element corporation and stocks can continue to 3 percent more than real GDP going forward, and that's common sense."



See the rest of the story at Business Insider

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Lessons In Hubris From The Herbalife Spectacle

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herbalife“I beseech thee, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be mistaken.”

 ~ Oliver Cromwell, to the General Assembly of Kirk

It’s interesting when traders (and investors) blow up. Sometimes you can see it coming, based on telltale actions or statements.

For instance, I remember reading Vic Niederhoffer’s “Education of a Speculator” in the  mid-1990s and telling multiple friends and colleagues:  “This guy is definitely going to blow up.”

In various spots, Niederhoffer bragged about his near-death experiences — wearing them as a weird badge of pride — including a story in which George Soros tells him point blank: “Get out… You’re in over your head!”

Soros was right. Niederhoffer’s bragged about almost-blow-ups later became actual blow-ups – more than one, for more than one trading fund – in a multi-year sweep of self-fulfilling prophecy. (A habit of selling naked option premium played a role too.)

Another well-telegraphed example is Bill Miller of the Legg Mason funds. At one point Miller was a mutual fund superstar, famous for having beaten the S&P 15 years in a row. His reputation was built on long side contrarianism — taking positions at odds with the general consensus.

But Miller was also terminally arrogant. He considered himself a student of poker, latticework, and multidisciplinary study — and was even a supporter of the Santa Fe Institute — yet proceeded to completely ignore every risk control lesson these pursuits had to offer.

When convinced he was right, the chance of being wrong never crossed Miller’s mind. On being asked how long he would keep adding to a position going against him, the reply was: “Until there is no longer a price quote.”

You can’t invent that kind of hubris… which helps explain why Miller loaded his funds with black-box financial positions, then plunged headlong into the abyss.

And then, of course, you have the Long Term Capital Management guys. As the old joke goes, LTCM had not one, but TWO Nobel laureates. With one they might have had a chance… with two they were doomed from the start.

 

Smart traders and investors take a keen interest in blow-ups for a simple reason: They don’t want to blow up themselves.

Witnessing and dissecting other blow-ups, then, is akin to careful drivers analyzing a fatal car accident. The question is, “Could that have been me in some unforeseen circumstance? What could I have done differently to ensure my survival?”

In trading and investing, excellent risk control requires walking a fine line between confidence and paranoia.

On the one hand, you take confidence in knowing that you never flirt with blow-up risk, ever… and that your risk-mitigating processes and protocols are so strong you never touch the borderline.

On the other hand, you never want to become so confident as to think “that can’t happen to me no matter what”… because a sense of permanent vigilance is one of the things that guarantees survival in the first place.

If you lose that sense of vigilance – a sort of healthy paranoia of the Andy Grove variety – it can be problematic.

This discussion comes about in relation to the Herbalife spectacle. In case you haven’t been following it, Herbalife (HLF) is a publically traded multi-level-marketing company with a slightly dodgy business model.

As a business, HLF is cash-rich. The questions revolve around whether Herbalife actually makes money from its products, or merely milks its “distributors” – i.e. get new recruits to buy product, find more recruits ad infinitum – which would make the company a pyramid scheme.

Bill Ackman, an extremely high profile hedge fund manager, publically announced a massive Herbalife short in December.

In essence Ackman declared himself “all in” – shorting more than a billion dollars worth of shares – and pounded the table for the company as a “zero” (in the assumption the SEC would take Ackman’s side, though Herbalife has been around since 1980, and shut the company down).

Herbalife shares plummeted on Ackman’s high profile presentation – a full on media event – then later reversed as other hedgies pushed back.

Robert Chapman, of Chapman Capital, put out an extensive piece titled “Herbalife: Why I Made It a 35% Position After the Bill Ackman Bear Raid.” And Dan Loeb of Third Point Advisors, another hedge fund heavyweight, announced an 8% longside stake.

Here are some background articles for the timeline:

chartAnd a recent chart (to the right). The acapulco cliff dive is Ackman’s big-gun presentation against HLF. The V-shaped rebound is the reassessment and Chapman / Loeb one-two punch.

(Full disclosure: We took a small long-side trading postion in HLF this week.)

Some of the best work on the Herbalife story has been done by John Hempton of Bronte Capital (who took a long HLF position shortly after the Ackman news).

In a piece titled “Notes on visiting an Herbalife nutrition club in Queens,” Hempton comes to this devastating conclusion:

Herbalife is a company which combines a lot of good (think the life-saved diabetic above) with some pretty ugly features.

But this is not really a story about Herbalife - Herbalife will survive globally. Like all multi-level marketing schemes it will have its ups and downs. There will be all sorts of problems (such as tax compliance throughout the scheme, cash handling, perhaps even using Herbalife accounts to launder money).

What this has (deservedly) become is the story about how Bill Ackman can be so wrong. He spent (by his own admission) a year and a half analysing this company and his thesis can be falsified by visiting a few clubs in his home city. Bill Ackman’s thesis is the most easily falsified bear-thesis I have seen from a major hedge fund ever.

You have to wonder how this happened. So I am going to tell you: 

Bill Ackman a Harvard educated (magna cum laude) billionaire New York hedge fund manager bet over a billion dollars on a short position (imperilling his fund and his reputation) without checking the facts.

And he did not check the facts because he was so rigid with a misplaced silver spoon that he could not stoop to sit on a subway for thirty minutes and talk with poor people for ninety minutes.

Let’s take a minute to discuss the mechanics of short selling here.

Many investors are afraid to sell short, pointing to the potential for unlimited capital loss. In most cases this fear is overblown and a canard, because it is just as likely for stocks to fall sharply as rise sharply – think “accounting scandal” as the flipside of “corporate buyout” – and it is possible to manage one’s shorts with a high degree of risk control. (Those same investors who “fear” going short often show little fear of getting hurt by oversized long positions with no risk point.)

To sell short responsibly, one can do things like 1) make sure your position is small relative to total assets; 2) make sure your position is small relative to share float; 3) make sure to use stop losses and only short liquid names; or even 4) use options to define your risk of loss 100%.

Ackman, however, did none of these things.

Instead he eagerly made himself the poster-boy of short seller blow-up risk:

  • He took a huge position relative to his $10B fund (more than a billion dollars’ worth)
  • He took a huge position relative to the stock float (roughly 20% of HLF shares)
  • He made it impossible to employ a stop loss (far too big and public a holding)
  • He basically dared the world to squeeze him (which may now happen)

Yours truly was a wet-behind-the-ears commodity broker in 1998. Some early market memories thus formed around the Long Term Capital Management (LTCM) unraveling.

One wild aspect of that LTCM unwind was the bottle-rocket price action in the Japanese yen.

Basically, all of Wall Street knew LTCM was massively short yen… and all of Wall Street also knew LTCM would have to unwind those yen positions (buy them back) at any cost. The result was a bloodbath (for trapped yen shorts) as USDJPY went vertical, in a moonshot reminiscent of the energizer bunny — it just kept going, and going, and going…

Time will tell, but the same thing could happen to Ackman with Herbalife.

If the Chapman / Loeb base case is correct, a reassessment of HLF fundamentals, combined with the potential for HLF share buybacks and knowledge that a great white whale (Ackman) is vulnerable, could lead to a historical recounting of Colonel Vanderbilt’s merciless squeeze of Daniel Drew, complete with the phrase: “He who sells what isn’t his’n / Must buy it back or go to pris’n.”

It’s fascinating, really.

Why would any super-successful money manager (or businessperson of any kind) willingly put their neck in a noose? Messiah complex? Compulsive need for attention? Megalomania? As with Niederhoffer and Miller, the warning signs went back a long way (years and years)…

 

Ackman is a billionaire, with a track record of great success. Now he is risking it all on a reverse asymmetric bet. If he wins, he gets another boost to his ego. If he loses, potentially everything he has built goes up in flames.

In a recent review of “Antifragile,” we discussed the importance of optionality – finding situations that offer large upside with limited and defined downside.

One can build a career, and a life, from basic optionality principles. With Herbalife Ackman managed to do the EXACT OPPOSITE… taking the mother of all “concave” positions (limited upside, non-trivial potential for absolute disaster) for reasons that are hard to fathom.

So what are some lessons from the Herbalife spectacle – useful takeaways regardless of how things play out?

Here are a couple:

BE WARY OF ARROGANCE.  

This should go without saying, but in hiring managers to run their money, investors fail to heed the basic lesson over and over again. When seeking a financial professional, you want confidence born of excellence and an ability to do the job. But confidence and arrogance are not the same thing.

Guys who are so arrogant they act as if they can walk on water (ahem, Ackman, cough) are prime candidates for blow-up risk, because their supreme smugness eventually gets the best of them (or fuels the situation that invites disaster in the first place).

For examples of confidence with humility (rather than arrogance), keep reading…

PUT PROCESS OVER OUTCOME. 

The enduring lesson of LTCM is that understanding process is every bit as important, if not far more important, than pure track record.

This is because bad habits, hidden hubris, and gross deficiencies of risk control can lay in wait for years before blowing up in investors’ faces.

Worse still, a bad process – rife with hubris – can contribute to the illusion of reliable profitability in the first place, before the fullness of time calls forth catastrophe.

DON’T PICK GNAT SHIT OUT OF PEPPER. 

Never has the expression felt more appropriate. As Hempton points out, Ackman spent more than a year and a half researching the Herbalife short thesis (by his own admission), and yet missed major disconfirming factors right under his nose.

The clear lesson here is that knowledge, especially fundamental knowledge of a trade or investment, has absolute limits. You can never get all the puzzle pieces — and even if you could, there’s no guarantee you will weigh all the variables correctly (one might dominate the others), or anticipate the X factor that derails your thesis.

As we wrote of Ackman on a message board last year (well before Herbalife unfolded):

That kind of granular activity makes sense for, say, private equity, where you are actually diving into the guts of a company, restructuring it and rebuilding it from the inside out — or for distressed debt investing, where the visibility is seriously opaque and it takes real forensics to get a true sense of risk levels — but from the stock-picking perspective as to which investment valuations will rise or fall, it’s the racehorse handicapper fallacy writ large: The false idea that if 10 variables are helpful, 60 variables are even better etc — or in Ackman’s case 600 variables. If he were a handicapper he would be sticking a periscope up the horse’s ass and taking bacterial cultures, then writing a 10,000 word thesis on the petri dish findings... For all his digging, Ackman is congenitally optimistic, to a potentially dangerous degree, and has happily admitted as much. Overkill on the micro side does not cancel out disregard of the macro side, though many seem to think it does, mainly because it can take a long time to see who’s swimming naked.

EMPHASIZE RISK CONTROL, MISTAKES, AND SURVIVAL. 

Paul Tudor Jones:“…at the end of the day, the most important thing is how good you are at risk control. Ninety percent of any great trader is going to be the risk control.”

Michael Steinhardt: “One of the advantages of trading the way I do — being a long-term investor, short-term trader, individual stock selector, market timer, sector analyst — is that I have made so many decisions and mistakes that it has made me wise beyond my years as an investor.”

Ray Dalio:“Anyone who has been involved in the markets knows that you can never be absolutely confident. There is never a trade that you know you are right on. If you approach trading that way, then you will always be looking at where you mght be wrong. You don’t have a false confidence. You value what you don’t know.”

And last but not least, Howard Marks: “Sun Tzu said if you sit by the river long enough, you’ll see the bodies of your enemies float by. The key is “long enough.” If you live long enough, you have to be the survivor…  if you look at distressed debt where we started in 1988, I could tell you who our number one competitor was in every year through 1995 and not one is a main competitor today. And it’s not because of what we did; all we did is perform consistently. They crapped out. It sounds simplistic to say, but the first requirement for success is survival…”

There’s a reason those guys are all legends…

JS (jack@mercenarytrader.com)

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UPDATED: Shares Of Herbalife And Nu-Skin Are Getting Crushed

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UPDATE 1: CNBC's Herb Greenberg, citing an unnamed source, reports that the FTC's press conference about an allegedly illegal pyramid scheme does not have to do with Herbalife. 

UPDATE 2: The Kentucky AG presser is about  Fortune Hi-Tech Marketing. Watch it here >

Shares of Herbalife, the multi-level marketing firm that hedge fund titan Bill Ackman is shorting because he thinks it's a "pyramid scheme", were getting smoked moments ago.

The stock was trading down about 9%.  It's now down about 4.5%. 

Another multi-level marketing company, Nu-Skin, was getting slammed as well.  It was last down 4.4%.

Nobody had any idea what was going on.

Traders got jitters about an FTC announcement in Kentucky that will target an allegedly illegal pyramid scheme.

There was no evidence that it had anything to do with Herbalife, which is based in California, but the news of the FTC going against anyone was being cited as an excuse for the selloff.

From the release: 

The Federal Trade Commission will co-host a press conference in Lexington, KY, today at 1 p.m. ET (Noon Central Time), with the Kentucky Attorney General’s office, to announce a major action against an allegedly illegal pyramid scheme.

Steve Baker, Director of the FTC’s Midwest Region Office, and Kentucky Attorney General Jack Conway will be available to answer reporters’ questions.

Check out the HLF chart here. 

hlf chart

Here's NuSkin's chart: 

Nu Skin chart

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Nassim Taleb Loved The Ackman-Icahn Blowout

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nassim taleb

Nassim Taleb is known for thinking outside the box, so when he gives his take one something, the Street expects to hear something fresh.

This afternoon he was on CNBC and, since everyone is talking about it, Taleb was asked about last week's epic live blowout fight between billionaire investors Bill Ackman and Carl Icahn.

A lot of financial pros told Business Insider that, on top of feeling amused and shocked while Icahn and Ackman went at it, they also felt a little queasie.

Not Nassim — no, he told CNBC that he loved it.

"A lot of readers of my book have e-mailed me the story and my reaction is... you should commend these people... they speak in public the way they would do it in private and that's rare...it's refreshing. People have a lot of fake dignity on the air, bureaucrats cannot do that, these people are free. They're human, if you hate someone and you can say it in private. They can afford to do it, God bless them... I don't like people to speak in public a different way than they would speak in private. I do not like people to speak in print different than they would at dinner."

Definitely a thought.

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Shares Of Herbalife Are Back Below The Pre-Ackman Short Levels (HLF)

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bill ackman

Shares of Herbalife, which has been one of the most controversial stocks lately, have fallen below the pre-Ackman short levels. 

Herbalife's stock fell $3.57, or 8.19%, to close at $40.02 a share yesterday.  The stock was last trading lower in the pre-market today.

Since December 18, the trading session before Bill Ackman confirmed his short, shares of Herbalife have fallen 5.84%.

The stock touched a 52-week low of $24.24 on December 24 and rallied back above the pre-Ackman short levels on January 14

Yesterday, the Federal Trade Commission went after private Kentucky-based multi-level marketing firm Fortune Hi-Tech Marketing and halted its operations for being an allegedly illegal pyramid scheme pending a trial. 

Even though Herbalife and other MLMs were not the target of that presser, the action still seemed to send chills throughout the MLM sector with shares of Herbalife, Nu Skin and Blyth all closing lower yesterday. 

During the press conference, the FTC declined to comment on Herbalife. 

Ackman, the founder of Pershing Square Capital Management, is shorting more than 20 million shares of Herbalife, a multi-level marketing company that he believes is a pyramid scheme.

After Ackman presented his short case at a special conference last month, hedge fund manager Daniel Loeb, the founder of Third Point LLC, disclosed in January that his fund had snapped up an 8.24% stake in the company on the long side.  Loeb said in a letter to investors that Ackman's short case lacks "merit" and his pyramid scheme allegation is "preposterous." 

SEE: The Greatest Hedge Fund Brawl In Ages Is Happening Now — Here's What You Need To Know > 

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Herbalife Buys 'Real Bill Ackman' Domain Names That Could Be Used In Counter-Attack

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Bill Ackman

Last month, hedge fund manager Bill Ackman, the CEO of Pershing Square, attacked Herbalife, the multi-level marketing firm that sells nutrition products.

Now the company appears to be stepping up its defense and preparing a counter-attack.

Herbalife has registered a bunch of Bill Ackman domain names.  And they look as though they might be used as a direct assault on the hedge fund manager.

The New York Post's Michelle Celarier reports that Herbalife now owns "therealbillackman.com, "billackman.net" and the "realackman.net" since January 18.  The sites aren't active (yet).

Last month, Ackman gave a 342-slide presentation at a Sohn Conference in Manhattan calling Herbalife a pyramid scheme.  His fund is shorting more than 20 million shares of Herbalife and has a price target of zero.

It didn't end there, either.

Following the presentation, Ackman's team launched "FactsAboutHerbalife.com"— a website that features documents, promotional material from the company, videos and depositions.

Ackman also purchased Google Ads when you search for terms related to Herbalife.

Herbalife responded immediately to Ackman's presentation saying he used "outdated", "inaccurate" and "distorted" information.  The company also hosted an analyst day in January to rebut Ackman's claims. 

Since December 18, the trading session before Bill Ackman confirmed his short, shares of Herbalife are down 5.84%.

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Look At What Appears When You Search For 'Bill Ackman' On Twitter

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What shows up when you search for activist investor Bill Ackman's name on Twitter?

It's a promoted tweet from Herbalife that sends you right to an 11 minute YouTube marketing video called "Our Herbalife,"points out Bloomberg's Matt Townsend.

Ackman's name isn't even in the tweet.


bill ackman twitter

We don't know how long the promoted tweet will stay up there, but it shows that Herbalife is fighting back.

Herbalife has also recently registered a bunch of Bill Ackman domain names and it looks like they're going to be used in a campaign against him.

Last month, Ackman presented his case at a Sohn Conference in Manhattan calling Herbalife a pyramid scheme.  

His fund Pershing Square is shorting more than 20 million shares of Herbalife and has a price target of zero.

Here's the full video:

SEE ALSO: Bill Ackman's Dizzying Takedown Of Herbalife >

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